I could tell how it is that WTC was in fact brought down by the impact of the jet airplanes. That a certain Islamic faction of terrorists were indeed its cause, but that some touch from others was not impossible. Popular opinion, a very poor guide to the truth, is otherwise. That Oswald was not the truly sinister forces of the assassinations, who were in fact protectors of wealth and privilege. IMHO. And I always thought Liberal and Neo Liberal were opposites, neo liberalism, actually conservatism, how it came to be called liberal I never knew. But then, I'm not the boomer of my actual age but a neo-WW2 generation freak created due to my separation from my peers as a child and indoctrination from the before people. That progressives may study hard and sincerely come to believe the nonsense from the Maga crowd, or have to go over because liberals cause the worlds problems, liberal solutions are off track, like social security, medicare, steep regulations, saving the planet, global warming, etc, etc, its simply delusional. The long term effects of the kool aid. The essay does not extend understanding to the right wing, but simply explores the dichotomy problem. I have conservative friends because I'm in the trades. Its easy to see they know off the bat, before I speak, i'm a god damned liberal, but they ignore it with the manly pact we are all men here. Its different entering the arena where all knives are out and the shouting has begun. I think, for me, the lines are drawn and we must follow our own lights. We simply have to find a way to wrest control from Maga, period.
I agree, and specifically about how RFK has been so viciously attacked by the left, which somehow believes now in the FDA and all kinds of high-tech medicine - I know there's something wrong with him, but they're attacking his policies. I loved that she mentioned Derrick Jensen, one of my very respected truth-telling people (with whom I disagree on some stuff). He, and David Rovics, and some other folks I know (all different from each other) are being attacked by the circular firing squad for being 1% different in opinions, or for treating the wrong people with respect, or etc etc. Maybe the reason I'm not like your friend is that I had MY first disappointment with Barry Goldwater and YAF - who did not hold to the principles they claimed to honor - and thus was immune to my very strong disappointment with the left.
Watching people get censored, deplatformed, and called names makes me wonder - a lot of things - one, who is driving this? Right-wing instigators, or actual leftists who have lost their minds and don't care about strategy at all? Two, what will happen to me when my book comes out? Ridicule or attack? And from who, besides all evangelicals? Will I go to jail? Probably not. I really would rather not, but it's my one big attempt to make a contribution.
The real tragedy of the commons is how power brokers have so cleverly inserted division via classification via simple and surface-level thinking via insults and name-calling among the commoners, while the elite strip the land, our culture, our laws, and norms to the barest of threads. The alternate facts, the retelling of history, the baseless arguing, the clickbait media, the embellished distortions, the outright lies, and the othering of everything alive are the propaganda playbook of the powerful. I don't have any Erins in my immediate circle, but I live in a MAGA county, and it is getting scary. The far-right sheriff has gathered a posse and refers to Democrats as "woke, brain-dead liberals." Last week, we stopped by a gun shop and purchased ammunition. Relatives and friends are a bit appalled. But my partner served as a US peacekeeper in the Bosnian War, where neighbors turned on neighbors because they didn't like their beliefs.
Hah. Your sheriff is being polite. The concise epithet is "libtards." Is that worse than "basket of deplorables"? How about "addled supporters of literally orange Hitler"? By now, all I can do is chuckle at the excesses.
But I gotta say this, Sue. The most prominent sentiment I am seeing on the Unwoke side is "we just wanted to be left alone." Whereas the woke side... well... messes with their kids from preschool on, messes with science and common sense ("men can get pregnant!"). ongoingly wants to take their guns, attacks traditional families, works to "defund the police" and refuses to prosecute those who make city streets unlivable, shuts them down when they complain at school boards, and when they try to get porn out of school libraries accuses them of orwellian censorship.... it just goes on and on. How about some compassion for the other side? And better, how about laying off the onslaught and doing some rethink?
I’ve had a similar experience. Perhaps even with the same person, as the name is the same. But perhaps not. And she also brought up Derrick Jensen. One of the aspects of now that is so divisive, is t himself, and the idea that there are only two sides here. We’re acting like that, but the reality is far different. If we could get rid of the names and labels and talk about actual issues, actual actions being taken, perhaps we would tease out the actual nuances and actually agree on something. Erin, (yours, mine, or ours) is correct about a lot she says. But “her side” doesn’t seem to understand the idea of keeping what’s working and expand on it, while ditching what isn’t, while “our side” seems to have forgotten that big pharma, big ag, the revolving door between all the lettered agencies and corporate CEOs, actually exists and have actually had a very negative impact on the work of the agencies.
It was strange to me to see all the so-called “left” suddenly loving on USAID! And suddenly accepting everything big pharma (the chemical companies in truth) has to say about vaccinations (and other things too but especially vaccinations that have been - and should NOT have been, politicized). I mean really? When I was having my kids, I was aware that vaccinations were a mixed bag of good and not-so-good, and maybe even bad. So I read a lot and took my time getting my boys vaccinated, and those were the days when there were many fewer vaccinations than today. Today? My personal feeling is that the schedule, the lumping so many in one shot, overloading baby immune systems, is potentially criminal. Yes. I said criminal, and I mean that. BUT that does not make me anti-vax. It simply makes me a concerned mother who struggled to figure out what was best for my kids. I think, too, as time passes (assuming we have time to pass), we will tease out the actual truth/reality about the covid vaccinations, and likely we’ll find out it, too, is a mixed bag.
Just like it shocks me to see people who love Earth, who do not support more clear cutting, mining, water extraction for profit, or certainly selling off our national parks and other national lands, simply accept that the EPA, the FDA, the USFS, the USDA, etc. are ALL bad and ALL a waste of money and that it’s a good thing to defund them! Certainly they have not lived up to their purposes, and way too often I’ve asked, “with friends like them, who needs enemies”. Like trying to stop clearcutting of old growth, or prevent mining and clearing in the Arctic (how many times have we fought agains that, won, and then we’re back fighting it again?) Then fighting GMOs. And lab grown “meat”. These are things the so-called left should be up in arms about, but they aren’t. At least not any more.
Mentioning FEMA, NOAA, Social Security, the frayed and soon to be totally destroyed safety net, USPS, all get shrugs. Obviously if they’re being defunded there has to be a good reason, right? Either that or I’ll hear - that’s just fear mongering. They haven’t actually cut anything yet. Totally ignoring the fact that there isn’t any way to give billions of dollars to the billionaires without eviscerating the programs that all of us rely on at some point, to keep us safe, to be there when we retire (that we actually paid into which seems to be forgotten in the discussion), etc. And, as you know, even if someone doesn’t get Medicaid help, their hospitals and other medical offices/services DO depend on it and those doors will be closed. I still wonder what will happen to all the seniors who had to spend down their savings and assets in order to qualify for Medicaid for their nursing homes, that they (and their families) expected would take care of them for life. When I’ve asked that question, they just laugh. Like I’m so crazy to worry they’ll actually put these disabled, sick, dementia struck people in the streets. Well . . . what WILL happen to them? They don’t all have families, and those who do probably don’t have families who can handle their many needs, including 24/7 staff.
In my conversations with my Erin, I know without a doubt there are things we can and do agree on. And the only way we can reach those agreements is to drop the politics, drop the buzz words, drop the personalities, and instead focus on the actual issues, the actual reality on the ground. There are some of the “opposition” who are able to do this. There are plenty who can’t or won’t. But for those that can, if we can engage respectfully about values and vision and what we love, it may make a difference in the next election (the midterms) . . . if we make it that far.
I can relate to the BDSM perspective of your essay. Been there done that an I f*ck(ng undressed a retired Marine gunnery sergeant after four years of his gaslighting...but I consented to it until I didn't. My agreed upon safe word wasn't in the mix...simply an ENOUGH sufficed. He knew the game was over. I stayed with him for another month until after the weekend long Blues Festival I so looked forward to going to every year. He helped me move out and we parted "like two ships in the night" having both learned our lesson. Don't play with fire / passion because it will destroy everything that is not authentically you. No more play-play. Getting real with it. There is only one way and His name is Jesus.
I could tell how it is that WTC was in fact brought down by the impact of the jet airplanes. That a certain Islamic faction of terrorists were indeed its cause, but that some touch from others was not impossible. Popular opinion, a very poor guide to the truth, is otherwise. That Oswald was not the truly sinister forces of the assassinations, who were in fact protectors of wealth and privilege. IMHO. And I always thought Liberal and Neo Liberal were opposites, neo liberalism, actually conservatism, how it came to be called liberal I never knew. But then, I'm not the boomer of my actual age but a neo-WW2 generation freak created due to my separation from my peers as a child and indoctrination from the before people. That progressives may study hard and sincerely come to believe the nonsense from the Maga crowd, or have to go over because liberals cause the worlds problems, liberal solutions are off track, like social security, medicare, steep regulations, saving the planet, global warming, etc, etc, its simply delusional. The long term effects of the kool aid. The essay does not extend understanding to the right wing, but simply explores the dichotomy problem. I have conservative friends because I'm in the trades. Its easy to see they know off the bat, before I speak, i'm a god damned liberal, but they ignore it with the manly pact we are all men here. Its different entering the arena where all knives are out and the shouting has begun. I think, for me, the lines are drawn and we must follow our own lights. We simply have to find a way to wrest control from Maga, period.
Thank you so much for this, Vicki! I do so love cycles of feedback. :-)
A revenge party? Hm. I would say that folks on the other side mostly just want to right what went wrong.
I agree, and specifically about how RFK has been so viciously attacked by the left, which somehow believes now in the FDA and all kinds of high-tech medicine - I know there's something wrong with him, but they're attacking his policies. I loved that she mentioned Derrick Jensen, one of my very respected truth-telling people (with whom I disagree on some stuff). He, and David Rovics, and some other folks I know (all different from each other) are being attacked by the circular firing squad for being 1% different in opinions, or for treating the wrong people with respect, or etc etc. Maybe the reason I'm not like your friend is that I had MY first disappointment with Barry Goldwater and YAF - who did not hold to the principles they claimed to honor - and thus was immune to my very strong disappointment with the left.
Watching people get censored, deplatformed, and called names makes me wonder - a lot of things - one, who is driving this? Right-wing instigators, or actual leftists who have lost their minds and don't care about strategy at all? Two, what will happen to me when my book comes out? Ridicule or attack? And from who, besides all evangelicals? Will I go to jail? Probably not. I really would rather not, but it's my one big attempt to make a contribution.
Also, everything Susan said.
The real tragedy of the commons is how power brokers have so cleverly inserted division via classification via simple and surface-level thinking via insults and name-calling among the commoners, while the elite strip the land, our culture, our laws, and norms to the barest of threads. The alternate facts, the retelling of history, the baseless arguing, the clickbait media, the embellished distortions, the outright lies, and the othering of everything alive are the propaganda playbook of the powerful. I don't have any Erins in my immediate circle, but I live in a MAGA county, and it is getting scary. The far-right sheriff has gathered a posse and refers to Democrats as "woke, brain-dead liberals." Last week, we stopped by a gun shop and purchased ammunition. Relatives and friends are a bit appalled. But my partner served as a US peacekeeper in the Bosnian War, where neighbors turned on neighbors because they didn't like their beliefs.
Hah. Your sheriff is being polite. The concise epithet is "libtards." Is that worse than "basket of deplorables"? How about "addled supporters of literally orange Hitler"? By now, all I can do is chuckle at the excesses.
But I gotta say this, Sue. The most prominent sentiment I am seeing on the Unwoke side is "we just wanted to be left alone." Whereas the woke side... well... messes with their kids from preschool on, messes with science and common sense ("men can get pregnant!"). ongoingly wants to take their guns, attacks traditional families, works to "defund the police" and refuses to prosecute those who make city streets unlivable, shuts them down when they complain at school boards, and when they try to get porn out of school libraries accuses them of orwellian censorship.... it just goes on and on. How about some compassion for the other side? And better, how about laying off the onslaught and doing some rethink?
I keep thinking about guns myself. All my neighbors have them.
Wonderful! Thanks for sharing. The connections with "consent" and "safe word" are brilliant.
I’ve had a similar experience. Perhaps even with the same person, as the name is the same. But perhaps not. And she also brought up Derrick Jensen. One of the aspects of now that is so divisive, is t himself, and the idea that there are only two sides here. We’re acting like that, but the reality is far different. If we could get rid of the names and labels and talk about actual issues, actual actions being taken, perhaps we would tease out the actual nuances and actually agree on something. Erin, (yours, mine, or ours) is correct about a lot she says. But “her side” doesn’t seem to understand the idea of keeping what’s working and expand on it, while ditching what isn’t, while “our side” seems to have forgotten that big pharma, big ag, the revolving door between all the lettered agencies and corporate CEOs, actually exists and have actually had a very negative impact on the work of the agencies.
It was strange to me to see all the so-called “left” suddenly loving on USAID! And suddenly accepting everything big pharma (the chemical companies in truth) has to say about vaccinations (and other things too but especially vaccinations that have been - and should NOT have been, politicized). I mean really? When I was having my kids, I was aware that vaccinations were a mixed bag of good and not-so-good, and maybe even bad. So I read a lot and took my time getting my boys vaccinated, and those were the days when there were many fewer vaccinations than today. Today? My personal feeling is that the schedule, the lumping so many in one shot, overloading baby immune systems, is potentially criminal. Yes. I said criminal, and I mean that. BUT that does not make me anti-vax. It simply makes me a concerned mother who struggled to figure out what was best for my kids. I think, too, as time passes (assuming we have time to pass), we will tease out the actual truth/reality about the covid vaccinations, and likely we’ll find out it, too, is a mixed bag.
Just like it shocks me to see people who love Earth, who do not support more clear cutting, mining, water extraction for profit, or certainly selling off our national parks and other national lands, simply accept that the EPA, the FDA, the USFS, the USDA, etc. are ALL bad and ALL a waste of money and that it’s a good thing to defund them! Certainly they have not lived up to their purposes, and way too often I’ve asked, “with friends like them, who needs enemies”. Like trying to stop clearcutting of old growth, or prevent mining and clearing in the Arctic (how many times have we fought agains that, won, and then we’re back fighting it again?) Then fighting GMOs. And lab grown “meat”. These are things the so-called left should be up in arms about, but they aren’t. At least not any more.
Mentioning FEMA, NOAA, Social Security, the frayed and soon to be totally destroyed safety net, USPS, all get shrugs. Obviously if they’re being defunded there has to be a good reason, right? Either that or I’ll hear - that’s just fear mongering. They haven’t actually cut anything yet. Totally ignoring the fact that there isn’t any way to give billions of dollars to the billionaires without eviscerating the programs that all of us rely on at some point, to keep us safe, to be there when we retire (that we actually paid into which seems to be forgotten in the discussion), etc. And, as you know, even if someone doesn’t get Medicaid help, their hospitals and other medical offices/services DO depend on it and those doors will be closed. I still wonder what will happen to all the seniors who had to spend down their savings and assets in order to qualify for Medicaid for their nursing homes, that they (and their families) expected would take care of them for life. When I’ve asked that question, they just laugh. Like I’m so crazy to worry they’ll actually put these disabled, sick, dementia struck people in the streets. Well . . . what WILL happen to them? They don’t all have families, and those who do probably don’t have families who can handle their many needs, including 24/7 staff.
In my conversations with my Erin, I know without a doubt there are things we can and do agree on. And the only way we can reach those agreements is to drop the politics, drop the buzz words, drop the personalities, and instead focus on the actual issues, the actual reality on the ground. There are some of the “opposition” who are able to do this. There are plenty who can’t or won’t. But for those that can, if we can engage respectfully about values and vision and what we love, it may make a difference in the next election (the midterms) . . . if we make it that far.
Thank you. You speak for me as well.
thank you for this long and informative - about the terrain we are crossing - response.
Passion ~ Rod Stewart - lyrics
Lyrics
Somebody somewhere
In the heat of the night
Looking pretty dangerous
Running out of patience
Tonight in the city
You won't find any pity
Hearts are being twisted
Another lover cheated, cheated
In the bars and the cafes, passion
In the streets and the alleys, passion
A lot of pretending, passion
Everybody searching, passion
Once in love you're never out of danger
One hot night spent with a stranger
All you wanted was somebody to hold on to yeah
Passion, passion
Passion, passion
New York, Moscow, passion
Hong Kong, Tokyo, passion
Paris and Bangkok, passion
A lotta people ain't got, passion
Hear it in the radio, passion
Read it in the papers, passion
Hear it in the churches, passion
See it in the school yards, passion
Once in love you're never out of danger
One hot night spent with a stranger
All you wanted was somebody to hold on to yeah
Once in love you're never out of danger
One hot night spent with a stranger
All you wanted was somebody to hold on to
Somebody to hold on to
Alone in your bed at night, passion
It's half past midnight, passion
As you turn out your sidelight, passion
Ain't right, passion
There's no passion, there's no passion
There's no passion, I need passion
You need passion, We need passion
Can't live without passion
Won't live without passion
Can't live without passion
Even the president needs passion
Everybody I know needs some passion
Some people die and kill for passion
Nobody admits they need passion
Some people are scared of passion
Yeah passion
what a post!
I can relate to the BDSM perspective of your essay. Been there done that an I f*ck(ng undressed a retired Marine gunnery sergeant after four years of his gaslighting...but I consented to it until I didn't. My agreed upon safe word wasn't in the mix...simply an ENOUGH sufficed. He knew the game was over. I stayed with him for another month until after the weekend long Blues Festival I so looked forward to going to every year. He helped me move out and we parted "like two ships in the night" having both learned our lesson. Don't play with fire / passion because it will destroy everything that is not authentically you. No more play-play. Getting real with it. There is only one way and His name is Jesus.
Fascinating